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Posted: Tue Jun 13, 2006 9:37 am 
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DEAR FRIENDS,

Did you ALL ever lookup the WORD "GRACE" in the Strong's Concordance, to find out the ORIGINAL WORD meaning, and not just rely on the "secular" meaning?

As you may have "studied to show yourself approved," as commanded to do, by GOD, instead of just "reading," then you know that "GRACE" was not just "unmerited favor," as the "just readers" presume!

GRACE (G5485, charis, khar'-ece, From G5463; graciousness (as gratifying), of manner or act (abstract or concrete; literal, figurative or spiritual; especially the divine influence upon the heart, and [HIS] reflection in the life; including gratitude): - acceptable, benefit, favour, gift, grace (-ious), joy liberality, pleasure, thank (-s, -worthy). [Note the words following the “: -“ are what the word was translated into, and NOT part of the original text definition, or true the Greek to English meaning!

Now instead of the “limited” meaning of “GRACE,” such as, “unmerited favor,” upon our “study” we find “GRACE” really means of manner or act . . . especially the divine influence upon the heart, and [HIS] reflection in the life; (including gratitude.)

That is NOT like having a “shorthand,” incomplete understanding of words, which GOD did not actually “inspire,” and replacing or restoring the WORDS of GOD, is NOT “taking away form the WORD of GOD,” which is a sin! When the actual WORDs of GOD produced a “revelation” with the original phrase, “especially the divine influence upon the heart, and its reflection in the life . . .

So if the “heart” was not influenced, nor changed completely as in the REAL meaning of “repentance,” that produced “HIS reflection in the life,” then NO “GRACE” was involved or produced!

NO TRUE Complete “CHANGE” than NO “divine influence upon the heart!” [Or "grace” as the WORD “limiters” refer to the meaning!]

The WORDs of TRUTH, or "HIS divine influence upon the heart” is what produced the “change of thinking,” which produced a corresponding “divine reflection in the life,” and that is what those who “limit” the WORDs of GOD call “repentance.”

Do you really have the “revelation” of the following verse . . . exactly what it really means, as it is the REAL GOD inspired definition instead of the “limiting” word "GRACE,” conveys? And just who has received the WORDs of “divine influence upon the heart?” And just who really has received the legal word that is also MIS-translated as "justified?"

Let us "reason" together only BY the WORD of GOD, and not just an assumption driven by “man's so called wisdom," from the “hand me down” sermons of sinners, instead of the TRUTH contained forthwith, by the WORD of TRUTH. . . Next GODLY "witness!"
Rom 5:21

(BBE) That, as sin had power by death, so grace might have power through righteousness to eternal life through Jesus Christ our Lord.
(HNV) " . . . that as sin [has] reigned in death, even so grace might reign through righteousness to eternal life through Yeshua the Messiah our Lord."
(KJV) That as sin hath reigned unto death, even so might grace reign through righteousness unto eternal life by Jesus Christ our Lord.

To get the TRUE inspired WORDs originally, instead of the MIS-translated word “righteous,” we seek and find From G1342, dikaios, dik'-ah-yos, From [the ROOT] G1349; equitable (in character or act); by implication innocent, holy (absolutely or relatively)
Equitable means equivalent or equal, identical, one and the same, identical (in character or act); by implication innocent, holy (absolutely or relatively) to the WORDS of GOD!
And innocent, holy (absolutely or relatively) means ABSOLUTELY HOLY!

SO with the REAL meaning placed BACK into the REAL WORD of GOD, from where it was robbed, the ORIGINAL TEXT of Rom. 5: 21 is rendered as

“As sin has ruled by bringing separation, the WORDs divine influence upon the heart, and [HIS] reflection in the life; including gratitude) may reign through equitable (in character or act); by implication innocent, holy (absolutely or relatively,) into eternal life through Yeshua the Messiah our Lord “

Which means without the FRUIT of E-quality (in character or act) by innocent, holy (absolutely or relatively,) than NO “eternal life by Jesus Christ our Lord.” Also for the mistranslated word “righteousness” we also “looked” and found these WORDS of GOD 1John 3:7 “Little children, let no man deceive you: he that does righteousness is righteous, even as HE is righteous, means holy (absolutely or relatively,) EVEN as HE is HOLY! Which brings us, who really follow the WORD, to “You shall be perfect as your Creator in heaven is perfect!” Matt. 5: 48 Well is your Creator Perfect or NOT, and are you “made in HIS IMAGE or NOT? WHICH!
See how the REAL WORDs of GOD RULE when a soul is really under ONLY HIS Divine influence and show HIS reflection!

OR in other WORDs only the “PURE of heart [mind] shall see [perceive] the WORD,” Matt. 15: 9, 5: 8 & Heb. 12 : 14

Again, if there is not a corresponding “holy (absolutely or relatively,) then there was NO TRUE “reflection in the life!” Can't have one without the other! Which means NO “eternal life through Yeshua the Messiah our Lord, “ or as the WORD “limiters” erroneously stated, NO GRACE!
And without TRUE "righteousness" than NO TRUE GRACE, as that is what this WORD of GOD, stated, and HE would NOT give grace to someone who did NOT choose to "reflect HIS holiness and purity," ONLY, because grace only "reigns THRU righteousness" and NO other way!
No "graceful sinners!"

Since “As sin HAS ruled by bringing separation, than HOLINESS is the TRUE “reflection in the life!”
NO “holiness” NO “grace,” because the ORIGINAL WORD of GOD said so!

There was, and is and will NEVER be such a creation as “graceful sinner,” by GOD!

WHY?

Because Gen 1:31 God [the Perfect WORD] saw everything that HE had made, and, behold, it was very good. . . ” And “very good” is by HIS PERFECT STANDARDS, not fallen man’s theology or "fallen concepts!"

And the basis of absolute HOLINESS is because Gen 1:27 “God created man in HIS own image. In God's image HE created THEM; male and female HE created them.” GOD does NOT "reflect sin" as HIS image, well NOT the WORD I serve!

If a soul is NOT the HOLY “image of the CREATOR” than the PERFECT WORD did NOT Create that soul, which means that the WORD of GOD is NOT that soul’s “divine influence,” NOR LORD, NOR Ruler!

I pray that you may allow the REAL WORDs of GOD RULE, so HIS DIVINE influence in the LIFE, that you are supposed to live FOR HIM is reflected as HIS TRUE holiness, absolutely!

Remember there will never be a GOD Created "thing" as a "graceful sinner!" NEVER was and never will be, GOD SAID SO!

_________________
. . ."And they that belong to Christ's HAVE crucified the flesh with the affections and lusts." Gal 5:24 "Who-so-ever sins belongs to the devil. . . " 1Jn.3:8 So do you really BELONG to Christ?


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Posted: Thu Sep 07, 2006 6:22 pm 
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I think I agree with your conclusion but I can't make heads or tails of your argument. :unsure: It is so riddled with misspellings, bad grammar and quotation marks that it's almost unreadable. And, although you begin with "dear friends," the whole post reads as some harsh diatribe against some doctrine to which we have supposedly subscribed. Could you post your contention again in a less convoluted and more succinct manner, so that we can really understand what you're saying?

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Posted: Mon Oct 16, 2006 6:02 pm 
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Joined: Sat May 13, 2006 10:24 pm
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Wow thanks for the reply!

Blessing to you shaken together, pressed out and running over, (that was not a direct guote, before you TRY to correct that also)

First of ALL there are NO mis-spellings (NONE)what-so-ever, as most of what you "gleaned" as wrong were the normal spellings when the STRONGS was written and when I copied and pasted in WORD 2000 there were NO mis-spellings at all. according to Microsoft, anyway!

Besides I'm just an unschooled fisherman and not a English major, just a sanctified soul that confounds the WISE in their own eyes!

I wasn't trying to "say" anything, as the WORD of GOD did and does ALL the saying for all who listen to HIS WORDs and do not bother just looking at how or who the messenger was but what the MESSENGER want to state!

Most who do not like the MESSAGE, like to attack the messenger, the way, or how it was written, and complain about all kinds of made up idiosyncrasies, that an the "wise" can't understand past their own cleaver understandings! Hope that was not the case with you?

You understood it!

Maybe, so "we" don't wander OFF Topic, maybe you can be so kind as to copie and past the so-called wrong spellings into a PM and show me exactly each and everyone you seemed to have problems with?
Again the English spelling was more "correct" in the 1800s than now!

Try re-reading just the TOPIC heading, NO such thing as a "graceful sinner," and that is what was basically the jest of the situation, or the summing up of the entire post!

SO are you ONE with the Sanctifier because you ARE sancitified your-self?

OH YA!
PS You stated. . . . Could you post your contention again in a less convoluted and more succinct manner, so that we can really understand what you're saying? . . .end of quote
Answer . . . NOPE!

But thanks for asking!

Be blessed!

_________________
. . ."And they that belong to Christ's HAVE crucified the flesh with the affections and lusts." Gal 5:24 "Who-so-ever sins belongs to the devil. . . " 1Jn.3:8 So do you really BELONG to Christ?


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